Paul Sonneveld
Hi everyone. Paul Sonneveld here, the host of this podcast and co-founder here at MerchantSpring. Now, before we're going to jump in today's session, I want to quickly share something that we're really excited about here at MerchantSpring. Over the past few months, our team has been working very hard on a completely new capability inside the platform, something designed to make it dramatically easier for marketplace operators and Amazon vendors to understand what's really happening in their business and where to focus next.
We've just launched our new AI insights agent, a fully AI-powered that continually analyses your marketplace data and services inside anomalies, opportunities and creates beautiful visuals that you can share with your clients and your colleagues. So without further ado, as you can see, I'm very excited. I'm just going to play you a little teaser video just to get you in the mood, and then we'll get this episode right on track. Here we go.
All right, as you can see, just making that video was actually a lot of fun. So thank you for bearing with me there. Yeah, just want to just a short plug here for my colleagues here. We are heading to prosper next week is literally around the corner is about. About six of us i think that are heading down. If you do find yourself in North America in Vegas next week, between March the tenth and twelfth, please please please come and see us, say hello, we're going to be at the booth 334, and we would show you the AI Insight Agent live and see all the things he can do.
All right. I have taken up way too much time of everyone. So let's really get along with this episode. Just want to say welcome, everyone. Again, thank you for joining us. Now, let me switch to today's conversation. Today's conversation is really about something that really, in my view, separates the average Amazon vendors from exceptional ones, and that really is relationships, specifically how you build strong, effective relationships on the Amazon vendor side, who the key people actually are within Amazon, and how you move beyond purely like this transactional way of working.
To help me unpack this i am joined by Travis Chappell, he is the head of vendor services at Venture Forge. Travis works closely with large brands to bring commercial clarity to their Amazon vendor operations, really drawing on deep experience across vendor services, buying brand management roles tied directly to Amazon. Within the context of vendor relationships, we'll also spend some time on AVS or Amazon Vendor Services, what role it should play, when it's worth the investment, a big question there, and how to manage it properly. And of course, how to get real ROI from what is often a very significant spend. So lots of things to get into there today. But first of all, Travis, it's so good to have you on the show. A warm welcome to you.
Travis Chappell
Thanks very much, Paul. Good to be back. And yeah, looking forward to be talking about some vendor topics today, I first got to say massive congrats to you and the team on the AI agents. Really slick video ever made, it properly deserves a raise. So, big kudos to you and the team, looking forward to using it.
Paul Sonneveld
Yeah, I wish I could claim much credit for the video, but I think well, actually, as a regular audience will know, my design and graphic skills um hit the limit a long time ago. So those of you who know me will instantly recognise that this video was not made by me, but by someone who's a real professional. So if you're looking for recommendations to do videos like this i'm happy to pass you his details.
But anyway, so let's get into the topic, Travis. You've been in this game a long time. So why don't we start with a genuine question around what does a strong vendor relationship actually looks like? Right? We all talk about, yeah, we want deeper, better relationships, like, hard to say no to it. But how do you know whether you've got one or not, or when you look at your clients, like, yes, they've got a strong relationship with amazon versus now these guys want to, but actually it's just transactional, how do you know?
Travis Chappell
Yeah, no thanks. So I think for context for the audience, in all honesty. So I'm ex Vendor Services did my career and my stint at Amazon UK at the head office. I was in the beauty team, so got some pretty good clarity on how to build those relationships. So, essentially, I think the relationships are mainly focused on transparency, honesty, and trust. I know those are quite buzzy and key sorts of words that are used and thrown around a lot.
But I think proactiveness is also a bit that comes into it. Is your vendor team proactively sharing market insights with you, benchmarks with you? Are they open to collaborative conversations? Do you have timeless relationships with them where you can just either pick up the phone, put in a meeting request, and they're obviously willing to answer it? Some people do, some people don't, but I think it's built on mutual outcomes, mutual goals. And obviously, that's set right at the beginning of the relationships.
Ultimately, it is a commercial relationship, end of the day. So if you're not making money, that is going to be under strain. But there are ways and means to set a solid foundation to essentially build that relationship on. That can be through joint business planning, VIP planning, then improvement planning. And then, yeah, essentially just NPD pipelines, pricing mechanisms and ultimately what your final goals are as an entire business entity. So, yeah, I've got a few slides which I can share a little bit later on. But ultimately, I'd say it's built on honesty, transparency, proactiveness and mutual benefits.
Paul Sonneveld
So when we talk about relationships, before we get into the how and all that, maybe it's just worth even just mapping out. Who are the people within the Amazon organisation, you know, as from a vendor point of view, obviously, that I should strive to have a relationship with, you know, who are the key people, as I'm sort of mapping out, you know, maybe Amazon's internal structure.
Travis Chappell
So I think first and foremost, let's start right at the bottom. Essentially, if you do have access to it and you do pay for it, obviously, Amazon's not a charity, as we all know. Um, if you do pay for a brand specialist slash AVS, that'll probably be your first front-line points of contact center at the bottom. They form into a vendor manager who ultimately does the overall commercial evaluation of your account and manages all the commercials, the AVNs, and all the really nitty-gritty discussions, sees them as sort of the next line of communication. Above them, they get a senior vendor manager.
Essentially, you probably will not have much access to a senior vendor manager unless you're a massive conglomerate or one of an enterprise-level brands, essentially doing north of probably fifty to one hundred million. Essentially, they very rarely get involved, but they give pretty much the oversight to the vendor manager and then the brand specialist. With them, you might also get access to the brand specialist team leads. They don't really have much financial acumen and input in it when it comes to commercials, but ultimately, they are the team leader of the brand specialists. So they need to keep accountable for if the brand specialist isn't pulling their weight, if they're dropping tasks, if they're not turning around requests and support requests quick enough. And then ultimately that leads into the category leader.
So the category leader is probably the, lack of better words, the big dog of the account essentially. And again, if you're a big enterprise-level brand, genuinely, you can probably put in requests to see them at QBRs. They'll join your QBRs because obviously, they know you drive a vast proportion of revenue within the category. There are smaller support functions in stock managers, for example. Some brands do have in-stock managers, but that really depends on your own logistical setup. Do you do WePay? Do you do VendorFlex? Do you have complex operational operations across sort of different regions? Is it a global operation? So you might get access to them.
And then I think right at the bottom of the line that it doesn't have a direct impact on your vendor manager's P&L, but it might be your ads manager, for example. Some VMs do see the benefit of looping in ads managers into the discussions purely because they know, okay, if I spend on ads, it drives awareness, it drives impressions, it drives people to the page and ultimately then the retail function checks in. So the pricing, the conversion drivers, like your content, your SEO kicks in. So it's the overall ecosystem, but yeah, if you want to do it quite quick, it would be AVS, VM, SVM, senior vendor manager, cat lead, team lead on the side, and then in stock manager and right on the peripheral would probably be your ads manager.
Paul Sonneveld
Perfect. I've mapped out the org structure. I know who I need to hit. Knowing who you should have on your radar, I guess, is the first step here. And your advice around different interaction points based on the service or the time of year or what's going on is super helpful. But that begs the question, of course, we've mapped them out. How do we move beyond the transactional? How do we really go beyond the email exchange to trying to build really kind of some strong relationships? This is where, hopefully, the gold is, right? I'd love to hear it.
Travis Chappell
That's it. So like I mentioned, it's a commercial relationship, end of the day. Even if you are the best of friends, you've got the best relationship, that's really nice to have. But end of the day, everyone has KPIs to hit. Everyone's going to be having their senior leadership team breathing down their neck to either hit profitability metrics, turnover metrics, selection metrics. Yeah, you know, all of that's going to happen.
I think first and foremost is sort of treat them as part of your team, not just a ticketing system, or a once-in-a-while reach out to them to either scold them or ask for requests. Treat them as part of your team. Invite them to brand-building days, to NPD release days. At my time at Amazon, I won't give which brand it was, but they're a huge French cosmetics company, so I'm sure you can probably do the math. I would go to their NPD days. They would give me samples to try some of their new products. They would really immerse me in the brand. And I sort of felt as part of the team, yes, I worked for Amazon, but I ultimately felt like I had skin in the game with the success of them as a brand. So make them feel as part of the team.
Again, with that, give them clear priorities and outcomes. Say to them, look, this is our goal for the year. This is the profitability we want to be at. This is the growth we want to be at. This is the market share we want to get to. And I think really map it out from the beginning of the relationship, especially once you get to AVN and all those nice things. It's not a tick box exercise that can be done in a month or a few weeks. It's a continually evolving cycle. Continually map your priorities, map your goals. Are you achieving them? Are you hitting milestones? Use your weekly business reviews for pulse checks. Use your monthly business reviews to set priorities for the rest of the quarter. And then use your quarterly business reviews for planning sort of the next seasonal part or the next half of the year, or any peaks that do come out of that.
And then I think use them regularly. use them for momentum not admin so ask them for market insights obviously amazon won't give you direct data goes against gdpr and all those laws but use them as a crux to get benchmarking data where do you sit within the category, how much do you contribute to the overall category, what's your market share within the category and then it'll help you sort of identify how you are seen within that category It might give you leverage during AVN. It might help you get some different swing within more senior stakeholders.
So like I mentioned in the beginning, you can request senior vendor managers to join your QBRs. You can request cat leads to join your QBRs. It gives you some nice weight in the negotiation. And I think also notice that their development depends on your development. Everyone's got their KPIs, like I mentioned, to hit. How do you build a relationship with your AVS and your vendor manager to say to them, look, how do I get you to your next point in your progression within Amazon? How do I get you as a vendor manager to a senior vendor manager? How do I get you as a senior vendor manager to a cat lead, for example?
And then AVS, how do I get you from an L4, which is internal terminology, to like an L5 to senior brand specialist, for example. So I think focus on their development also and show that you're willing to play the game as long as they're willing to play the game. And that's not so you can just set overnight. That's through building relationships, seeing them in person where possible. Granted, I know some people are offshore, but yeah, there's a lot of ways and means to really build on those relations. And those are just, a few of the touch points to go through and ways to do it.
Paul Sonneveld
Yeah. I mean, that is so useful. I actually wonder, I mean, I don't have any poll software ready to go right now, but if I had one, I would really ask, the people that are tuning in across the different platforms, how many of you would actually know what the core KPIs are that your vendor manager or the person on the other side of the table is actually striving for in order to help them succeed in their career? I mean, it sounds kind of, of course, it makes sense, but actually knowing it and aligning you and helping them on that journey, I think, is so powerful.
But i'd love to get your obviously you've been on that other side of the fence and i want to ask you the inverse question which is, what what behaviors or approaches tend to damage vendor relationships and i'm sure there has been vendor relationships that have rubbed you the wrong way when you're on the inside or maybe helped you clarify which vendors you should prioritize and which ones maybe you should ignore when it comes to returning phone calls or emails. You know, what are the sorts of examples of behaviours that are not productive in terms of building relationships?
Travis Chappell
Yeah, I think grabbing the wrong way is the right term and a very political term, if I can say it like that. So I think paying for AVS isn't to solve a bullet. It's not going to solve all of your problems. So don't expect that. I think it's expectation setting. Essentially, if you as an AVS or a VM, set the expectations to the brand and say, look, you aren't the only brand I am working with. That should be quite obvious. Essentially, I get they are stretched in capacity. They are stretched in workload. But some of the sort of ways that you can sort of avoid having a friction relationship is sort of be proactive in your comms.
Don't wait for them to reach out to you because no one wants to be chased, essentially, as an AVS. Give them a lot of time in the loop. So if you're doing an investigation or there's a ticket you're working through or there's an update or a catalogue clean you're working through, keep them in the loop throughout the process. A lot of people are paying a lot of money for an AVS service, sometimes up to each five percent accrual that they sell in. So that could equate to hundreds of thousands of pounds easily.
Keep the proactiveness essentially. Hey, Mr. Vendor, I'm just working on this. I'll be back in XYZ days. Just wanted to give you an update that things are progressing well. So proactiveness is a good way essentially to build that rapport. Also, don't expect the AVS to fix cross-channel problems. I know as an AVS, I used to have brands that would hammer me and say, look, why are you price matching XYZ marketplace or XYZ retailer products? Ultimately, I have no sway in that. Amazon is a price follower. They're not a price leader. So I think playing that game with your point of contact to make them realize that you don't have sway in that. And ultimately, it is up to them to keep their cross-channel commitments clean.
So, selective distribution agreements, not selling below the market average. Again, obviously, pricing is set at the sole discretion of the retailer. But making them understand that you, as an entity within Amazon, can only control what's within your remit. Amazon is a huge org, but it is very siloed. You need to raise tickets, and you speak to specialised teams. You don't have a magic wand that can just wave certain problems away. It is a collaborative piece, I guess. I think making them understand that you are one cog in a bigger wheel is a really important piece.
I think also focus on operations, essentially. Operations is one of the biggest cruxes when it comes down to Amazon. If you're Brand doesn't have the right stock. They don't have the right confirmation rate. They're not confirming products. The full rate's terrible. The pricing's terrible. That is going to have a knock-on effect into your metrics. You're going to get hammered from your vendor manager, even though it is out of your control like that. They're going to say you should be more proactive. You should have more forward planning.
You should build a close relationship with your brands. But ultimately, if your brands don't do their good housekeeping, it is going to have a trickle-down effect into you. That's going to eat your KPIs. Ultimately, that might stagger your growth in the business and put you a little bit in the crosshairs, if I can say it like that with Amazon. So, yeah, I think having that mutual respect to know you can only do what's within your remit and things do take time. That's probably the fundamental piece of it.
Paul Sonneveld
Yeah, that's very helpful. How does that play out during commercial negotiations? Right. So, because I mean, there's a bit of role play sometimes that goes on during commercial negotiations. A bit of acting, you know, sometimes throwing out your toys out of the pram. How do you balance that? Yeah. How do you balance the maintaining good relationships, but also having some really firm commercial, you know, pointy end, you know, with some pointy ends to it? Like, how do you balance that?
Travis Chappell
No, I think that's a really good question. Obviously, the relationship piece is such a small part of the overall story. I think if you come with data and you can back that data up with a good narrative, that is already about seventy five percent of your problems already gone because the numbers don't lie. Obviously, make sure your numbers are sort of aligned to what they see. And that alludes to what I was speaking about previously, where it's continual improvement, continually audit the results, continually audit the deadlines, continually audit the goals. And let me know. Well, let the brand know essentially what your priorities are.
So I think data is first and foremost. Amazon thrives and just loves data. They'll hit you with all the data metrics. And if you don't come armed with equally important data, you're just going to be stuck in the water, and it's going to be like a, hey, trust me type sort of scenario, which you never want to be in. So I think first and foremost, have the data there, have the right metrics there. Also, focus on the metrics which mean the most to the brands as an AVS. I got the brand might not care about how many units they sold in the last week. They wouldn't know what their market shares grown in the last quarter, what you plan to do during peak periods, what type of deals you're going to be running, what type of level of investment they need to give all those types of thing is come with the right data, which means the most to the brand essentially. I got, I'm not saying all data is irrelevant, but focus on the ones that are going to be the needle movers, the revenues, the sell-ins, the profitability.
Back in the day, selection was a massive metric. Amazon wanted to be the one-stop shop for everything. They've started culling a lot of products now because they realise it's not profitable. And I think for the last four to five years, if not maybe six, they've really been focusing just on profitability. So yeah, come with the right metrics, come with the right data, and we'll be able to back it up. And it'll allow you to show your teeth a little bit more. Essentially, you can be a little bit more bullish on your requests.
Paul Sonneveld
Let more of the data do the talking rather than just pure emotion.
Travis Chappell
That's it. The numbers never lie. The numbers never lie. Emotions cross over things, and it just gets into a little bit of a firefight, and that's somewhere you never want to be with Amazon. Let the data do the talking.
Paul Sonneveld
A hundred percent. So you mentioned AVS before, obviously in the broader piece, but I want to sort of zoom in into this particular topic a little bit more because it's expensive. And may be perceived as a shortcut to a great relationship. It's almost like paying for a relationship, I guess, as some vendors may look at that way. So in your view, Travis, how would you characterise AVS within kind of the broader vendor relationship and specifically within the strategy to build a deeper, beyond transactional relationship?
Travis Chappell
Yeah, no, good question. AVS, they're the grunts of it, if you want to see it. They're on the front line. They're the tip of the spear. They're the ones getting all the action, all the flak. They're the ones that report into the VM, essentially. So I think building that relationship early on with your AVS is an important piece. I get it. Amazon started offshoring a lot of AVS relationships to the Far East to Central Europe. So it is a lot harder to see those people in person. But ultimately, if you do have the opportunity to i would encourage you as a brand to go and meet your AVS in person, go meet them at their offices, take some samples with if you really want to sweeten the deal and like I said, really immerse them within the brand.
The AVS are going to be your first port of call for most instances; they the ones that's going to be doing all the grant work on your brand, so all the catalogue cleanups, all the ticket raising, all the pricing mechanisms, all the deal creation, they feed into the VM. So ultimately, if you hamstring them and essentially can't give them the information they need to provide to the VM. They're going to see you as a, let's say, a deteriorating sort of asset. I know it doesn't sound great, but essentially, if you don't continually foster that relationship and stoke it and grow it and get them involved with driving new selection, driving profitable selection, building deals, taking their requests on board.
And I think ultimately also celebrating their achievements. If your AVS does something good for you and you've hit your deal OPS or you've hit your selection target or you've hit your profitability target, celebrate it. Don't be shy to drop a VM to the cat lead, to the team lead, to the vendor manager, to senior vendor manager and be like, look, your AVS is bloody good. They've done a great job. They've actually achieved everything we wanted to achieve. Everyone wants that recognition in life. And I mean, it's just a way to celebrate it.
So I think yes, there's that commercial lens of it, and they are the frontline, and they're not a ticketing system. They should be immersed within your team. They should know your priorities. They should know what your goals and ambitions are as an actual brand, but also don't forget they're human at the end of the day. Once they clock off, they go and do the same thing as you and I, they go home, go to the gym, go see their friends, go have dinner, go to bed. You know what I mean? They're not a robot, and they shouldn't be treated as that really immersed them in your brand, make them feel human and celebrate their achievements where possible.
Paul Sonneveld
Yeah, treat them like humans. And really, the way you're describing it, I was thinking like, as an extension of your team, right? That's sort of the way that the word that came to mind there, which absolutely makes sense. And of course, you're kind of vying for that, you know, they, it's not a one-to-one relationship, they will be looking after many other vendors as well. So in a way, you're trying to vie for a disproportionate resource share. You don't want to be sort of bottom of the pile there. That makes sense.
Travis Chappell
And it just means they'll be willing to allocate more time for you. They'll probably want to go the extra mile for you. Treat them as an extension of your team. They just don't sit in the same building, essentially, like you said.
Paul Sonneveld
Yeah. Now, clearly, this resource is expensive. And when I've discussed this with people in the industry, the answer always comes back to, OK, this is an investment. Just like any other investment, you really have to manage it, get the ROI and all that. That makes sense. But I want to ask you, Travis, is there any circumstance, maybe from a theoretical point of view or that you've encountered, where actually it's just not worth the money? It doesn't matter how nice the person is and how many things they're doing. It's just not worth it. Is there such a scenario, and if something comes close, what would that look like?
Travis Chappell
So it's a good question i think, if it doesn't make sense for you financially, don't agree to it first and foremost. If you can't afford it as a brand, don't throw it in because you're going to have that resentment throughout the year, and that's already a bad benchmark on where to grow from. Admittedly, I see a lot of value within AVS. I get even the bad ones are better to deal with than dealing with the ticketing system, if I can say it like that. Yes, you get the shining stars, and if you're lucky enough to get them, excellent. Hold on to them tight. Give them good feedback during the satisfaction questionnaires and surveys, all those good things. So try and keep them tight.
But ultimately, a bad AVS is better than a pretty mediocre average ticketing system. They've got a lot more mechanisms internally. They've got access to more relevant teams. They've got quicker turnaround time. If you are a complex operation or a brand that struggles with logistical issues or delivery issues or anything like that, catalogue issues, they generally are a lot of a better conduit to get a successful outcome quicker than raising it through tickets, waiting for the ticket to be responded to. That could take days. It could take a few weeks. And also, there might be language barriers depending on where the person's based. There might be contextual barriers. where the person's based through the ticketing system.
So I would say if you can't afford an AVS, don't go for an AVS. Obviously, don't be a strong arm by Amazon into an AVS, look for ways and means to obviously spread that investment out somewhere else. But if you can afford it and you can build that relationship, and it does make financial sense to you, a good AVS is better than an average ticketing system, if I can say it like that. Oh, sorry. An average AVS is better than a good ticketing system.
Paul Sonneveld
And especially the case log system.
Travis Chappell
Painful, painful at times.
Paul Sonneveld
Yeah, actually, to be honest i've been getting great support lately but
Travis Chappell
Hey, whatever magic you're working, send it this way.
Paul Sonneveld
Yeah, there's no secret source, unfortunately. I was going to, I mean, so the takeaway I got from that was really, the more complexity in your business, particularly on the operational side, things going wrong in terms of Amazon, the more you probably benefit from AVS, or you could, at least hypothetically. Yeah, could. Just a minor follow-up question. What do you do if you get assigned a person and you just think they're hopeless, or you not responsive. In other words, you're fully on board with the program; you just want another person. How would I go about that?
Travis Chappell
And that sadly does happen like you mentioned, bandwidth constraints, geographical constraints, time zone constraints all of those do have a factor into play, I'd say, be brutally honest. Obviously, don't disrespect the person. I hope all the audience and everyone isn't like that, but be honest with them and use it during your AVN. We've got some brands in turn that have, unfortunately, suffered with a bad AVS, and they keep a shared document of correspondence, timings, actions that haven't been completed, tasks that have never been closed, requests that have never been picked up, because ultimately end of the day, it is your investments.
So when you get to an AVN level, you can pull this up with the vendor manager and say, look, I'm giving you guys hundreds of thousands of pounds, and I might as well just throw it into a well and wish that something will come out of it because I'd probably get a better response and probably get better outcomes. So make sure you keep a track of all your requests internally, any emails that have never been answered to, any requests that have never been picked up, meetings that have just not been put in, no shows on meetings, all of those types of thing is keep it very, very, very honest.
And also, when you get the satisfaction surveys from Amazon on the AVS service, be honest, give full insights into why you're not happy, give reasons, back it up with data points, and back it up with evidence also. And if that still doesn't work, try and get hold of the cat lead or the vendor manager and obviously escalate. Don't go over your vendor manager's head initially like that. Rather speak to them and try and work something out because ultimately it is their direct report. But if you're still not gaining any traction, don't be afraid to go to the team lead and the cat lead because ultimately they do have the final decision in it.
Paul Sonneveld
That is really good advice. Manage it actively. Keep records. Don't shy away from it, but be factual. Amazon is still a data-driven organisation, even when it comes to these things. So good to keep in mind. We are over the thirty-minute mark, and usually we tend to wrap things up, which I will endeavour to do very shortly. But I just want to throw in a live question here from Rachel.
Thank you, Rachel, for popping us the question, because I think a lot of vendors are currently struggling with this, particularly depending on which geography you're in. But so Rachel's asking or stating, you know, we've had three vendor managers in the last four months. And we're really struggling to form relationships through this change. I mean, yeah, that makes absolute sense to me. What advice can you share, Travis? I mean, it sounds like a very challenging situation, very transactional, very transient. What can a vendor do in this situation?
Travis Chappell
Well, first of all, Rachel, obviously, thanks for the question. And admittedly, I don't envy you, but I do feel for you. Like, very sorry if you hear that. I would say, can can the VM relationships then for now get in touch with the senior vendor manager or the cat lead they enroll for a lot more of a specified time purely because they don't really have day-to-day remits or interactions with brands. So if you can form a relationship with a cat leader, a senior vendor manager and get them on your side, they might be able to give you better insights into why the VM turnover is so high, or is there any problems with your account that people don't want to touch it? I don't imagine so, like that's very rare that happens, but try and build relationships with more senior stakeholders, ones that are in the position for a lot more time essentially.
So senior vendor managers, cat leads, those are generally the people that have been at Amazon five, ten, fifteen years essentially, and they're not going to be leaving anytime soon. So if you can build relationships with them, you're probably going to be in a lot better place for trying to get things done. Also, don't take it personally. I would say vendor managers come and go within Amazon. Also, Amazon is doing a huge purge of employees. So very sad to see, but that is just the nature of the beast with Amazon. So I wouldn't take it personally. It's not probably on your account. It's just the turnover, the stress. Vendor managers are under a lot of bandwidth constraints. Some of them look after fifty, sixty brands, essentially like that. And some people just can't hack it for a long period of time.
Ultimately, the crux is the I'd say try and build relationships with more senior stakeholders, ones that have been there for a long, ones that you know aren't going to be going anywhere and sort of give these reasons to them and say, look, we want to grow. We want to play the Amazon game. We're willing to invest. We're willing to do all those nice things, but we essentially just can't. And this is the reason why. And we'd like to know why and get a remedied situation. So yeah, try and build the relationship more with senior vendor managers, and then the cat needs also.
Paul Sonneveld
Great advice. Thank you for your question, Rachel. That's fantastic. A really good practical question. I think certainly a lot of vendors would have similar questions to that. So thank you for raising that. And thank you, Travis, for that answer. We do have to wrap up. So, Travis, I really want to thank you for joining us today. It's been super practical and a really grounded conversation about how should vendors really think about their relationship with Amazon.
We didn't talk about golf trip or corporate box events, a very different type of relationship building perhaps than what some of us are used to in sort of more the traditional retail space. But it's been super super helpful travis and I really appreciate you sharing your experience with us Now, before we say goodbye and wrap up, is there anywhere you want to direct people if they want to, you know, follow your work or follow up with you on some questions or learn a bit more about your work at VentureForge? What's the best way to get in touch?
Travis Chappell
Yeah, thanks a lot, Paul. So firstly, obviously, thanks. Pleasure is always for being here and chatting with you. It's always great to just catch up and obviously speak to the audience. So, yeah, if you'd like to connect with me, LinkedIn, just straight Travis Chappell. That's my name there, Travis Chappell. Chapel, C-H-A-P-P-E-L-L, or you can reach out to VentureForge at hello at VentureForge.co.uk and just direct your question to me. But ultimately, I'd say LinkedIn is probably the best way to go. And excuse if there is any cringy videos or cringy posts that do come up because I am a LinkedIn aficionado. So enjoy it, guys.
Paul Sonneveld
Fantastic. Travis, thanks again for joining us on this episode today. Happy to be here.
Travis Chappell
Thanks a lot. Catch you all later.
Paul Sonneveld
All right, we'll let Travis go from here. Everyone, thank you so much, especially those who joined us live and asked questions like Rachel. That was really fantastic to have you spend some time with us and engage with us. That's what makes these sessions really, really useful. Now, of course, just a quick reminder that we are about to head to Prosper. So if you are going to be there, please, please, please come and see us. There it is at booth 334. We'll be there most of the week and would love to meet in person. And of course, show us our new insights agent in action. Thanks again for listening. And I look forward to seeing you again at the next Marketplace Masters. Take care.